Thermal Laminator

Hi, Larry

I had the same dilemma as we can get a whole spectrum of laminators. Finally I decided to get an A3 format laminator as it has a metal case, a feature much needed for the temperature we need. You need a variable temperature laminator for you have to modify it. The maximum temperature (in my case 180) was also a thing as you can get laminators operating well below the 200 degrees. You need to modify a bit the circuit to get 200 degrees temperature. Usually the sensitive element is a thermistor in touch with the hot roller. The thermistor gets into a resistive divider and the voltage drop on it goes to a comparator. The reference voltage is set by the potentiometer of the laminator. This is the place where you should slightly adjust the resistive divider – on the potentiometer. I also add a temporizer for FWD/REV rolling of laminator, a 555 circuit plus a relay, which gives 4 sec FWD/ 2 sec REV for the pressure rollers. That’s slowing the process and give time for the temperature of the PCB to raise, usually the PCB goes relatively fast through the rollers and doesn’t have time to reach the necessary temperature. Cheers, Daniel.

@mikiduta I am glad to see I am not alone and I am sure there are others.

Finding a simple way to get what is needed and to making it work.
I believe this one get more people making PCB.
I been tempted to try my wife machine, but do not liking sleeping in a dog house.
Not knowing the specifications needed for the thickness needed and heat and how to get there.

Looking like I should be looking for a metal case.

I hoping to see what others have done.

Thank you Daniel.

@larry_n7luf I’m using a modified Apache AL13P2. Don’t know if they are still available or not. Bought it about 3 or 4 years ago. It has all metal case and 2 heated rollers. It has an add-on board that plugs into existing connectors. The board allows to switch between PCB mode and normal laminator mode. It allows for higher heat settings and does a sort of back and forth motion moving it slightly more forward each cycle. It has worked very well for me. I bought the kit from a guy at a one man company called Quantum Harvest (no affiliation). Don’t know if he still makes them or not. His kits were based on the plans posted on hackaday at:

https://hackaday.io/project/3363-apache-al13p-tl-320b-one-pass-pcb-toner-xfer/details

@robotwizard Looking right now getting the “Apache AL13P2″, but the plans I did find, Thank you

I added the following link to my last post, but it didn’t save it:

https://youtu.be/9__WHZto6iI

You said you are looking to make “some” PCBs, not sure how many that is, but if you’re not looking to crank out a lot of them I’d personally just recommend using a different method. I’ve used a clothes iron, and also have clamped the PCB to the paper and put it in the oven. Both methods have worked great for me. In my opinion printing the laser toner as thick as possible onto the sheet is the most important thing. Make sure the print settings lay it on heavy.

Modding a laminator just seems like a ton of work unless you plan on cranking out a ton of them, or do lot of prototyping like Mr. Carlson.

@kaf To me it is just a hobby and enjoy putting things together. For year I have been want to make Paul capacitor testers and have not done so since 2017.
The only thing missing is a way to make a PCB, is the transfer method and over caution. You are right, as there are other ways, thank you.

@kaf Well, modding a laminator is not a ton of work. If you’re building MCL projects then you should already have the skills needed. Took me about 30 minutes to add the kit. It’s a simple board and wouldn’t take much to make if needed. I start the board into the laminator and walk away, then I can get the next board ready while it’s running or go do something else. I put a pan of water on the output side and the board drops into the water when it’s done. I used to use the iron method before I had the laminator. No thanks, I’m, done with that.

My wife was not at home and I tried to see if a PCB would fit her machine, and it did pass through.

Now after get out of the hospital, she said I could try to make a PCB.
Hope the temperature will be hot enough, as it say it only go to 125 C  Max.

I’ll be following this thread, as I am interested in buying a laminator as well. I do believe Mr. Carlson had mentioned he was working on a laminator project for his patrons.

My last two PCB’s were transferred using a T-shirt press, and it worked quite well. This worked much easier and better than using the clothing iron I had used previously. The only issue is that it takes much more space to store than a laminator 

@larry_n7luf You will likely need the mod to get it hot enough…and that’s assuming you’re using an older printer with lower temp toner. The following quote is from a guy who used to have a company that sold toner transfer PCB supplies for 40 years, but has since gone out of business. I corresponded with him a number of years ago and this is what he said:

“Your Laser Printer: All of the newer laser printer manufacturers (starting back around 2005 with Brother) have slowly all transitioned from conventional toner (55% pulverized styrene) to a form of Epoxy-based plastics that fuses at around 400º ~ 500ºF. This toner simply doesn’t refuse from the transfer paper to copper-clad PC boards. Pouch laminators just don’t get hot enough for this new type toner as the highest temperature laminators get to is only 300ºF. This one of the reasons for the demise of our products.“

@robotwizard don’t you have to modify it to increase the gap between the rollers to allow those thick boards to pass? It’s been quite a while since I’ve watched the laminator video, however I have to believe that in order for a three or five mil laminator to accept a thick circuit board you would have to modify it. Or am I wrong?

@kaf You turn it over and and adjust 4 spring loaded screws while you have the case apart. I don’t remember exactly how many turns. You set it once and forget it. I can still go back to using it as a regular laminator at the press of a button.

@robotwizard i went and free watched the laminator video. Did you design a circuit for increasing the temperature of the laminator? Mr Carlson has not released that design.